| T O P I C R E V I E W |
| woodboat |
Posted - 09/25/2005 : 1:43:50 PM
This is regarding my 1973 Voyager 3120 (wood) however may well apply to other folk re-working their Carver...
My boat has many issues and as we get onward to the cold weather in the North, the winter allows for planning and in the Spring, action.
- The plywood lapstrake bottom is weak in numerous areas, mainly due rot of the plywood at the seams. Rotting appears to be from the inside - out. I explored the idea of epoxy laminating new ply between the ribs from the inside, however now feel it best to sheet the outside of the hull below the waterline. I am not anticipating anyone on this forum having done this, but wonder if there might be some of you able to offer opinions. As others, I will attempt to do this 'on the cheap' and am intending to use 1/4" subfloor, epoxied to existing bottom, but not epoxied on the exposed (outside)new bottom for fear of trapping moisture that might get in if the bottom is damaged while boating. However a penetrating epoxy coating on the new bottom might be valid? My understanding is that subfloor ply is well made and uses waterproof glue - and we know it is relatively much lower in cost than marine ply. I also feel 1/4" is enough, and I will fill interior damaged areas with epoxy. Ribs for the most part are OK
Formula for square footage below waterline = LOA x Beam x .85 |
| 15 L A T E S T R E P L I E S (Newest First) |
| woodboat |
Posted - 04/23/2009 : 9:49:54 PM
Some of you may recall that I had a massive oil leak from the upper shaft seal a few years ago, and now have finally (with help) replaced the seal... originally tried to keep from having to remove the drive from the boat, however it is necessary (to heat up the casing and fit the bearing)...
Vee drive is now re-installed, however the alignment is off, and seems to be the cause of the seal failure in the first place... will have to experiment in trying to align this properly...
... the vee drive alignment is only one of the challenges, also need to redo the entire AC from the shorepower inlets to final outlets.
In these two photos you see the posts and beams I am installing to allow the flybridge to handle the weight of six or eight bodies up there. The original roof rafter are just not strong enough, and with all the glass on the outside walls, I felt that sistering the rafters was not a real option to support the weight.
The posts are galvanized steel, rather heavy and 1.5" dia ... a little overkill, but the price was right (free) . The beams are steel T bar... a bit rusty but also free ... will dress them up somehow - someday.
Would seem to be a rather unsightly addition to the salon, and I am not overly pleased to have to add these, however they will serve as passenger stabilizers in rough seas, and best of all can do saturday night duty as ... ummm... dancing poles lol
The flybride also needs much work still, as does the cabin and salon (you can tell from the above pics lol) and I have two weeks from when i return to Ontario to get this boat livable for the summer, as i have no other home other than my van...
This is not a complaint, it is a choice i made willingly. Did it seven years ago on a different boat as i had no home then either... ah, how history repeats itself 
Also, the entire shelter is for sale for $1000. ... can be erected by one person ... double woven Fabrene cover, very durable... sturcture is 36ft x 14ft x 15.6ft high inside dimensions. Must be sold NOW! lol ... if a carver member can use it, will sell for less... wood alone is $900 !
2x4 and 1x4 wood frame construction... the pic shows cover going on. ... let me know if you can use this... it really is an incredibly weathertight building and has been up without incident for several years ... still good as new - the Fabrene will be good for a dozen years or more.
This will be my last post for a bit. Leaving BC for Ontario in a couple of days, will only have intermittent Inet access for the summer, but will check email - and here if someone can use the shelter ... email is: nicosan4all@gmail.com ... Thanks and keep smiling ~ Steve 
|
| Rockmeister |
Posted - 04/19/2009 : 9:21:04 PM
Welcome Jamie!
Steve, your work is looking great!
Can't wait to see ya in the water! 
79 28' Mariner twin inboard V-drive.
SW Lake Erie: Maumee Bay & The Islands |
| solomongrundy |
Posted - 04/19/2009 : 3:01:50 PM
WOW!
A Carver 28' forum! I LOVE the internet.
Before I reply to this post I just want to introduce myself, my name is Jamie. I'm a shipwright by trade, I (believe it or not) have a degree in wooden boat building from NWSWB, and I have a 1973 lapstrake 2880.
Fiberglass is most often a death sentence as a repair for ANY wood planked boat...unless it is glass over ply as new construction.
The the reason for this is simple, wood is porous and glass is not, when you lay up glass onto wood, the wood will expand and contract but the glass will not. This is called modulus of expansion. In short order the wood will separate from the glass and moisture will fill the void with nowhere to go. It creates more problems than it solves. |
| woodboat |
Posted - 04/17/2009 : 5:49:31 PM
Here is the completed platform (that was shown a couple of pages ago in the shop) mounted and essentially ready to roll. It is shy of the full transom width by some six inches either side to allow mounting of the stern lights and also to reduce the chance of hitting it in poor navigation at docking or anchoring to islands. The fact that I measured short has nothing to do with it.
I used standard big-box store shelf mounts ($10 ea), and had to trim the outboard ones. They are thru-bolted (stainless) at the top (2x) with nothing at the bottom (to reduce water infiltration chances). Sturdy enough imo
Note the knots and all...
As mentioned on a previous page, I used 5/4 Cedar 'decking' ,6" wide stock, used deck screws to fasten together, epoxy and cetol coated.
Since the brackets are 90degrees not the 106 or so required due to the angle of the transom ( would have needed custom manufacture - read $ lol) I had to create shimms to try and level.
It is indeed a bit of guesswork in leveling the platform, since the boat is not level on the trailer. Fortunately I had done much to try and get the aft waterline level when I changed and painted it, so used this as a guide in making the shims for the platform leveling.
Just to clarify, the boards are not epoxied to the support members etc... just coated. I used deck screws because they were the easiest to work with and since they would be coated anyway I figured they will last as long as the rest of the boat (hopefully)... there i go cutting corners again ... and look at the sloppy work... a wrong pencil line burried under coats of goop lol ... the fishies will appreciate the laugh!
|
| woodboat |
Posted - 03/24/2009 : 8:41:08 PM
Glad there is a little enjoyment of my madness what can I say...
In between much of this, the hull received it's final coat of paint. While the hull is far from as smooth as new, and even farther from fibreglass smooth, there turned out to be a limit to how much fairing I was willing to do ;-)
Not visible here is the final touch on the rubrail - the installation of the chrome protector strip... however i do not have enough of this to do all of the boat ...
This details the finished transom and side 'plank', and also shows the completed installation of a top ' trim-board' on the transom... no idea what this trim would be called properly, however the original boat did not have this but I felt it aided in the overall appearance. It is Cedar, encapsulated in epoxy and tripple Cetol coated like the rest.
Here is another photo of the trim and finished transom. Next post will show the installation of the home-made swim platform.
|
| Rockmeister |
Posted - 03/20/2009 : 5:00:59 PM
WOW Steve!
Looking great!
Your "inventiveness" is impressive!
The end result really looks awesome!
(Is your head getting big yet? lol)
Rock
79 28' Mariner twin inboard V-drive.
SW Lake Erie: Maumee Bay & The Islands |
| carvermitch |
Posted - 03/20/2009 : 3:12:05 PM
Wow you are doing a great job and once again thanks for the great photos.
An inspiration to all.
regards
Paul
http://www.carvermariner.com |
| woodboat |
Posted - 03/18/2009 : 6:23:48 PM
The actual install of the decking was fun ... much more so than the seaming ... which was quite a chore because...
First I stained the deck a bit of a reddish look, then installed a coat of epoxy. This I followed up with pouring brown latex paint into the seams... trying to cut down on the work of taping off all the seams I figured that once the planks are sealed in epoxy I can wipe up paint spills and not worry about additional staining of the deck...
However the paint kept shrinking back when it dried, so I decided to tape and caulk, but since it requires as lot of caulk and my budget does not allow the purchase of the 'right' seaming compound, I used brown acrylic latex caulk... my thinking being that these seams (and the entire deck) will receive three coats of epoxy and then three coats of Cetol Marine ... this should be enough protection to allow this to work... ?
In this pic you note the already installed first coat of epoxy ... taping up this entire deck (and some parts a second time for re-application of more caulk) was a lot of work on hands and knees and up/down ladders... just like so many other projects on this resurection... thinking of a boat name... Last Chance or Dock Rot or Last Love ... hmmm
It remains to be seen if this holds up during the sun and heat of the summer(s). For now, it looks pretty good, especially considering the entire decking material and epoxy etc was cheap - i.e. < $100. ... however definitely NOT cheap on my labour lol
Here is the mostly completed new deck... whaddayathink? These last two have the full three coats of Cetol Marine applied already, so the red (and everything) is toned down a lot... wonder how it will look in the sun?
Note the knots in the Cedar trim (and of course in the deck)... I culled the worst of the knotty boards out of the pine decking. Rather neat what can be done with little money and lots of work... ahhhh wood boats lol
This is the best I have of 'before' that I can find (for now).
|
| woodboat |
Posted - 03/05/2009 : 1:54:05 PM
Hi rockmeister... re the curve... presume you are referencing the cedar bow boards? ... those were cut from wide planks, not (steam) bent ~ Steve |
| Rockmeister |
Posted - 03/03/2009 : 6:45:22 PM
Looking good!
Gotta love new paint!
How did you get that much curve in your wood?
Did you steam it and bend it?
79 28' Mariner twin inboard V-drive.
SW Lake Erie: Maumee Bay & The Islands |
| woodboat |
Posted - 02/20/2009 : 1:37:57 PM
While installing the wood on the transom, at this time I also intermittently painted the hull, coating one side at a time and masking/lining the boot stripe in between drying spells.
As noted earlier, I 'adjusted' the position of this waterline both forward and aft and used photos I had made years earlier to guestimate the desired location.
I sure hope that the paint 'sticks' ...
These events were followed with a major undertaking - woodyfying the decks. I debated for quite some time (with me, myself and I, lol) as to whether I wanted to work this hard, but in the end the work effort gave way to the desire to see if I could actually do this... pull it off so to speak ...
So, since there is no money in my budget, I used some cheap 5/16" #4 Knotty Pine panelling - you know the kind you buy in 8ft lengths, packed six to a bundle and with the portable table saw ripped both tounge and groove to leave a 'plank'.
These are about a buck a board, so the cheapest decking I could find ...
Here is a photo of the 'drug' table... mixing batches of thickened epoxy to glue the planks down. These were held in place with permanently installed finishing nails.
Installing the bow decking was a thrill, as it really made the previously installed cedar 'trim' jump out and seemed to sort of 'complete' the look imo.
Sanded the edges a bit, culled the obvious garbage planks, and proceded to lay out and cut and dry-fit my new deck.
|
| woodboat |
Posted - 02/14/2009 : 2:40:28 PM
While progress was steady for several weeks, there have been a few setbacks... this was one of them.
I installed the aft entry doors, which swing up and were held in place by hooks and plastic chains. Now the glass (you may recall) is 3/16" plate from the old-time sliding glass windows.
This glass is quite heavy, and after some days, the hook holding the doors gave way and both came swinging down to a closed position. When hitting the 'stops' the glass kept going... such a racket that the neighbours came over to see if things were alright. It was a shock to my system at the time and quite a mess to clean up.
It was a good thing that nobody was in the tent at the time... the shards of glass flew with significant force outward, and in numerous locations pierced the double coated woven tarp that encloses the wooden framework on my shelter.
So now, the glass is a plexi of some kind (I forget now what I used, but have a friend in the business and got a good deal on 3/16" single pieces about 28"x48"). This is much lighter and should work fine... leaving a bit of space for expansion, I sealsed the outside edge with clear silicone and hope that this will keep the water from seeping through ...
There was TONS of glass outside the boat of course since the motion was toward the outside (easier to clean up but still very sharp)
|
| woodboat |
Posted - 02/12/2009 : 3:57:39 PM
Hi once again...temporarily settled in the desert in California (read no water here), and with a somewhat workable internet access, I have a bit-o-time to update some of the work completed last spring and fall. Still planning on being back in North Bay, Ontario this summer to work on the boat a few weeks before launching. Since I no longer have a 'house - home', I expect to live on this boat at the local City marina. There is much that needs to be completed for this to work out. Among the items I need are 120v AC electrical panel so if you have one...
... a full AC rewire is in store (I have only installed the shore power plug so far) also need to do a full replumb for water and various 12vDC rewiring. I have the galley to finish rebuilding and lots of sanding/refinishing, curtains, flooring and the list is ... ummm... endless lol.
Here is the new flybridge being installed. Always fun doing new installs. All items were previously dry-fit prior to cetol application. The parts were then assembled and glued and screwed together - to be essentially one unit.
IF there is a requirement to remove the flybridge (for transport perhaps) then the entire unit now can be removed as one piece and set down on the foredeck.
Meantime, other major projects of fun were underway, including 'woodifying' the transom. Previously plywood, fibreglassed and painted, I epoxied selected mahogany subfloor cut into 7 3/4" strips to - look like fake planks onto the stern. I ran out of the nice dark stuff, so picked another 'pattern/colour' for the top 'plank'.
The 'planks' were cut on my portable table saw, out in the yard, which of course is less than ideal for getting straight cuts (over an eight foot lenth). Still, I did pretty good, and after dry-fitting the pieces they were epoxied onto the platform and fastened with finish nails (which were left in place).
Following a clear coat of (10% thinned) epoxy, I filled the seam gaps with a wood flour epoxy paste.
|
| Rockmeister |
Posted - 07/16/2008 : 6:59:56 PM
Hey Steve!
Yes, I was referring to the rear windows for the canvas & can understand the wind issues.
And yes, by racking resistance, I mean the lateral movement of the flybridge floor and walls.
(Separate issues actually)
Maybe extend the stainless rail for the back of the flybridge to connect in at least 2 spots to the sides of the flybridge walls to help stiffen the assembly?
(Mine does this and it helps a great deal.)
Reading with interest! Thanks for the info!
Rock
79 28' Mariner twin inboard V-drive.
SW Lake Erie: Maumee Bay & The Islands |
| woodboat |
Posted - 07/14/2008 : 7:26:21 PM
Hi rockmeister, ... I do not know what 'racking resistance' is... but surmise it is lateral movement? So I presume you are referring to the actual side of the flybridge moving sideways... - the bottom of the side panels is fastened indirectly to the deck, but the top is indeed free to move quite a bit sideways due flexing, and as of yet I have no solution.
And my appologies, but I do not understand where you are referring to with this item "Why not just frame the edges of the rear of the back deck and use canvas to fill it in? Thinking it would be much easier to open/close etc and add some racking resistance." Are you referring to the roof area or the area where the windows go? I am not a fan of canvas, especially where I keep the boat, as we frequently are exposed to 50 - 80kmh (30-50mph) winds off the lake. Canvas just does not stand up the the abuse but keeps the boat top guys smiling lol
I should have used the 1/4" veneer- could not find 1/8" and so used the paper backed I had on hand, but butchered it badly. But for now it is staying like that - maybe in a few years I will grind it down/off to flatten things and redo it with the thicker stuff.
Have been real busy with various other things (plus getting ready to go to Switzerland for a couple of weeks end July) but there has been progress on the boat. Will try to do an update here before I go. Thanks for the interest ~ Steve |
|
|
